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Welcome to the Thrive Marriage Lab with Restory Counseling, where we help you explore the why behind the what. Because guess what? We believe that your marriage is not a problem to be solved, but a mystery to be explored and enjoyed. We believe that the more you explore and know your story, the deeper your marriage connection will be. This podcast is now the audio version of our new YouTube channel, Thrive Marriage Lab.

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where each week you can expect us to help you cultivate connection and belonging without the fixing and tips and common things you often hear in the marriage space. So find us on YouTube or listen in.

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So we can't talk about marriage without talking about trust. Marriage is all about trust. And I think we all know that. That feels like a pretty known component. It's like, okay, great. I don't need to watch any more of this video because I already know that. However, however, here's why we're bringing it up as we're talking about pre-marital things and conversations. And that is that we can't talk about trust. We don't need to talk about trust unless we talk about the inevitably

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true thing that's going to happen, and that is that there will be betrayal. You are gonna know betrayal. If you haven't known it already, it's something that is coming. Welcome to the Thrive Marriage Lab. I'm Tracy Johnson. I am a story work coach and supervisor at Restory Counseling. And my name is Chris Bruno, and together with my wife, Beth, we post videos to help you understand the why behind the what.

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Because we believe the more you explore your story, the deeper your connection will be. And if you like what you're hearing here, we invite you to hit that subscribe button, turn on notifications so you don't miss a beat in helping your marriage thrive. We are in a series for premarital couples, couples that are engaged, wanting to do some work on their relationship before they walk down that aisle, which is brilliant and beautiful and necessary.

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And here we are in a conversation about trust and betrayal. So as Tracy just said, welcome to the Thrive American Lab and welcome to the reality of some of the things that you do need to address before you walk down that aisle. So when we think about trust, it kind of comes with the word truth. It might come with the word betrothed. Like what is this thing that we're talking about? What is it? What does it even really mean to...

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have trust and and and share that with your spouse. I love the way you talk about it. You use a word you like. A word I like. Which word do I like? Like the word Roth. You like that word. You like the word Roth. Yes. Okay, we can edit that out a little bit. No, I want to leave it. Let's just leave that exactly that way. Which one are you talking about? Oh, um, yeah, so

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You just named several words and they're all related, right? There is the trust, truth, betrothed, the troth that we have. The issue is when you think about the word betrothed, when there is a couple that is betrothed or a person who is betrothed, there is a promise that has been made. There is a ruling narrative, a trust narrative, a truth narrative that you have attached yourself to.

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that there's something that you've said yes to and has said yes back to you. That now is your truth. You are betrothed to that truth. And that betrothal creates a level of trust. It actually says, I am committed to you, you are committed to me. And that commitment builds that bridge of trust between us. I know that when I step out onto that bridge, that it is going to hold up the weight of what I bring.

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We like to talk about trust as a bridge between two people because it is that sense of like, there is a sense of risk that when I take a step out, is it going to hold me? And the betrothal between us, the truth between us actually is that foundation, actually is gonna sustain this relationship. And as you said just a moment ago, like there are gonna be some cracks, there's gonna be some betrayals, there's gonna be some issues that we trip on along the way.

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and whether they are big or small, they need to be addressed. So how do we actually address those? It's a great, I mean, it's a great question. I have always really appreciated how Dan Allender defines betrayal as the breaking of an implied or stated commitment to care. Yes. I think in the realm of marriage, that feels like such an important way to hold

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what trust is really tied to this sense of like, you've made a commitment that you're gonna care about me. So trust is broken then whenever I have some experience that you don't care. And so it kind of lives on this spectrum. And I think we're hesitant to bring the word betrayal and yet we feel it in our bodies. It's like, I felt like you didn't.

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care about me, like right there when that happened. And so it can be as simple as like your spouse, you're having some sort of a conversation with them, maybe even in the kitchen over coffee in the morning and they get irritated like, I can't talk to you. And they just turn and walk out. Where'd you just go? Just happened. What just happened? And it feels like in that moment, it's like it's a little micro

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moment of, I don't care anymore, I can't stay in this conversation with you. Right. And so I think oftentimes we have those sorts of moments. They're like that. And they're just these little cracks that start to erode that bridge. And once those little cracks have started, we're on our way to something that's going to feel like a bigger betrayal and a larger breach of trust.

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Yes, and I love that you just said cracks because, you know, as we're talking about the bridge metaphor and all that, I can just imagine, right, that there are there are some cracks in the pavement of this bridge that goes across the water. There's some cracks in the pavement that unless they're addressed, they will get bigger. They won't get smaller, right? Unless they're tended to and addressed, they won't get smaller. They will only get bigger. And you just said like the micro moments that that is where

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some of those little cracks begin to start. And what a great opportunity. I feel like when we talk about these things, like people are afraid to address the cracks because then they're actually acknowledging that all things are not well in this relationship. And I just wanna say probably all things are not well in the relationship. And the sooner you address the reality of that and tend to those cracks, the better it's actually going to go for you in your relationship. Because rupture and repair, those two words are used often.

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in the realms of relationship counseling, that there needs to be some kind of rupture and a follow-up repair that makes that rupture better again. It repairs what was. If there is rupture and no repair, that's what we're saying. The cracks just continue to be there and they just get bigger and bigger and bigger. Your word micro moments just kind of makes me think there are micro moments and there are macro moments. There are small little cracks that are far easier to address if you have the...

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courage to do so. And if you don't address those, those will, like I said, a macro moment will end up resulting. And as you said, you know, and I think this is part of the hesitancy, like, I don't want I don't want for it to not be well. And so I just like that just wasn't a big deal. Right? That just wasn't a big deal. And I think I want to say, like every day, there are moments that are not well. It doesn't mean that that's the overarching

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like narrative of your relationship, but it can become the overarching narrative of your relationship if you continue to act like these unwell moments just don't matter. And so the small repair of just even coming back in and saying, hey, I felt frustrated. I walked out on you. I am sorry. Like that was about me and what was going on. There's probably a bigger conversation here. I have to go to work.

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but I just want to say, like, I know I walked out. That repair, that just turning back towards can stave off, it's not going to turn into a giant crack then. And so that tending to those little ones, certainly. I think part of what happens is that rarely do we have a couple that comes to us somewhere down the road in marriage and have them tell us like,

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Yes, we tended to all these small moments and we were so good about all that. And then we just have this major rupture that nearly has taken us out. That's just never the story. The big rupture always comes with the moments of micro rupture that we're leading prior to it. And what happens is that you get to a big rupture, like something big happens and holding any kind of hope.

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that this can be repaired just feels so foolish at that point because you have, you have the memory, right? Of all these, well, it's not just that they did this big thing. It's that they walk out on me in the morning when we're having coffee and they hang up on me and they don't return my texts. And right. You've got all of these smaller moments and it's like, okay, now we've got a huge issue. Right. You know, it's interesting as we talk in the realm of relationship,

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how, and our word today has been tending to those cracks, how it's hard in the context of relationship to kind of think about that. But if we step away from relationship and just think about other things, right? You get a college degree through several classes along the way. You get back into shape with several decisions.

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that you make around your exercise and your food along the way, uh, on the, on the other side of things, how does one get a cavity? It's not like, hey, there is a cavity and the next day there's not a cavity. There's decisions along the way to not tend to something or how do you become unhealthy is not tending to something. So that's what we're talking about. So how to build trust that lasts is attending to,

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micro moments, these micro cracks that happen in your relationship, so that unto the reality that your foundation is built and stronger and can withstand some bigger things. The other piece that, you know, it's not always the betrayal that causes the earthquake. There are going to be moments along the way where tragedy strikes, where there's a loss of a job or there's a bad diagnosis. Or

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there's some kind of issue with a relationship outside of the two of you. If you've not tended to the foundation of trust, like we're talking about, it is actually gonna fall out from underneath you in the moment of tragedy. And so it's important for us to be tending to these things along the way, because inevitably something is gonna come down our way, and I don't wanna be all doomsday about it, but we just know that tragedy happens. It does happen.

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in everyone's lives and we need to have the foundation of trust tended to so that in that moment I am with you and you are with me and we are together. I trust you to have my back in this moment of tragedy. Yeah. So. That is a heavy topic. It is. So next time we're going to take on an equally, no, I think it's an equally heavy topic, but hopefully more fun to talk about. It's a fun topic. And so.

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Yes, next time we're talking about how to explore the story of sex in your marriage. No premarital video series can be absent of a topic of sex. So join us. It'll be fun.

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If you like this, there's more where that came from. Go to Thrive Marriage Lab on YouTube to check out all of the marriage resources we have for you. We are so committed to helping you develop a deeper and more connected relationship that we have created 12 free.

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curated date guides to walk you through one year of good dates that we believe take you beyond your average date night to the kind of connection you really want. So head over to Restory.life slash thrive dash dates or just look in the show notes to subscribe to get those for free in your inbox for one year. And if you're curious about us, you can find us over at Restory.life.

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where we look forward to hearing about how your marriage continues to grow. See you same time, same place next week.